UCET discover new fish first?

[Ian A]

An article has been published by the BBC claiming that a new "cave fish" has been discovered in Europe - Southern Germany.

It's here;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-39446505


However, while in Poachers I saw that fish (not that exact one) but one identical.

I was with Doug, Ade and Jodie on the 23rd March 2017.

I stopped everyone so they could look at it. It was in the first low duck at the back of the cave and sat on top of the silt. The others could not get around me to see it without the silt being disturbed but they will recall the precise description I gave which matches the photograph of the one apparently newly discovered in Germany.

I think that's one for us.

 

Ian

[Robin Jones]

Bagsy calling it "Fishy McFishface"

[Doug Thompson]

I can confirm that Ian was very excited about a fish that he could see, which he said looked a bit like a catfish of some kind, wish I had seen it myself.
Mind you, the first cave fish in Europe seems a bit of an exageration, what about the white trout in Ogof Draenen, I have seem them.

[mick murphy]

I,ve seen loads if fish in caves they are called fookin big eels I have even had one swim up my boiler suit
 even though it scared the shit out of me it put a smile on linda,s face to see it wriggle  so what the hell
mick

[Ian A]

I think what the BBC were getting at (read the link at the outset)is that this particular fish has evolved in caves (rather than simply being found there) and, as such, is "new".

They are reporting that the first one is in Germany.

However, I am convinced that the one we saw in Poachers is identical.

.... Which means we discovered it first !

 

Ian

[Anthony Britner]

Need to go back for another look and to try to catch it alive.

[mike leahy]

[quote="Ant89" post=30786]Need to go back for another look and to try to catch it alive.[/quote]

why have you got a bag of chips  :whistle:  :whistle:

[Ian A]

[quote="Ant89" post=30786]Need to go back for another look and to try to catch it alive.[/quote]

Where there is one there is likely to be more?

Any fish that are brought in from the surface would not be "new" and would be identifiable as non-indigenous.

The fish we found cannot have come from the surface and neither can it have been flushed down to the levels below (it could not get back up).

It is significantly likely it is still there and is part of a teem .... Because it could not exist there otherwise.

And, it does exist there.

QED

 

Ian

[mike leahy]

its been flushed in from the river alyn , div :evil:  :evil:

[mick murphy]

i think most fish that are born in complete darkness deform to some point eg look at the fish in the oceans
at depths of 4 miles + a lot of these each year are new species what would a human child born in a cave and never saw daylight at 50 would his eyes be blacked out would his noise have changed shape to sniff out food
would he have hair and every time he has children and they have children something must change in a complete
dark world over time you would not look like us today

[Ian A]

[quote="mike leahy" post=30789]its been flushed in from the river alyn , div :evil:  :evil:[/quote]


If you bothered to read the BBC article you would realise that is impossible.

.... I accept your apology.

 

Ian

[mike leahy]

fuck the bbc. what do they know, especially about the river alyn which has a direct feed into poachers . and yes i will accept your apology
 oh and there bloody german (they bombed our chippy you know)

[Anthony Britner]

[quote="Ian" post=30788][quote="Ant89" post=30786]Need to go back for another look and to try to catch it alive.[/quote]

Where there is one there is likely to be more? quite possibly. Would be interesting to find out if there is a population in there.

Any fish that are brought in from the surface would not be "new" and would be identifiable as non-indigenous. it's likely that some fish do occasionally get washed in or had been washed in at some point.

The fish we found cannot have come from the surface and neither can it have been flushed down to the levels below (it could not get back up).

It is significantly likely it is still there and is part of a teem .... Because it could not exist there otherwise.

And, it does exist there.

QED

 

Ian[/quote]

Some direct replies in bold above.
Finding one or more would be useful for determining species. In all likelihood these are a fish you will find on the surface but isolated by a few generations. Perhaps a new subspecies?

Question is though. Why do you discover all the new species

[Ian A]

I think, in a case like this, you need the guidance of an "expert".

We have one.

The BBC (if you ever bother to read the report) explains WHY the species (or perhaps as Ant says, "sub-species") is indigenous to caves and cannot have come from the river above.

Furthermore, it is quite impossible for the fish (in the BBC article) to have originated from anywhere except from inside a cave system.

I am totally convinced I saw the same fish. I described it as such to those with me at the time. (Doug has already confirmed) The only possible doubt is that I saw no colour in the one in Poachers. However, it is a bottom feeder by nature and was sat on silt. I had my lamp aimed directly at it and I doubt that any pink tinge would have been visible in the circumstances.

I can affirm that, what I saw, matches EXACTLY (the above accepted) the fish in the article.

If that is true, the entire species MUST be present in Poachers and cannot have come from above or below (save for Ant's sub-species statement).

The expert is Ant and I am satisfied he knows exactly what he is talking about.

All things being equal, it will be possible to go back and find "them" (there MUST be a host of them) and prove it beyond doubt.

Given the importance the BBC have attached, I would say it is monumental.

The last time I discovered a new life form (well documented and photographed) it was sent to various universities and "lost". This is defo one we are chalking up to UCET.

Ian

[mike leahy]

Well why aren't you in their with a camera :ohmy: